Kismet

[bill_schubert]

Many years ago I was stationed in Alameda.  Somehow I was fortunate enough to get military housing in this nice little pocket Naval Base at Pt Molate.  The base was made up of some fuel tanks and about 28 small two bedroom historically protected houses.  The houses were built in the early 1900s for the vineyard workers.  The Naval base was originally a working vineyard.  In WWII it was secretly converted into a fuel depot and was still functioning as such when my wife and two rugrats moved into one of the houses.

The base was run by a junior supply officer and had a cross section of a very few junior officers and mostly enlisted families.  This was in the fall of 1984 and into the spring of 1985.  The Navy still traded around reel to reel movies.  Each base and ship typically had two movies.  These were not always first run but occasionally they were pretty recent.  There was a huge market in trading the better ones for the dogs.  The Supply Officer was in charge of movies and, in the last days of pre Internet, he was in charge of movie night.  I can remember only one and I don't recall what the movie was but several of the families popped popcorn and walked down to the main building to watch the movie projected in a small room on a fairly small screen.  It was wonderful.

We were there for Halloween and I had a tape of scary sounds blasting from our porch loud enough to be heard across the community.  When the woman started screaming we were standing in the adult group, beers in hand, and someone said 'sure sound like she's enjoying it more than afraid of it'.  The screams sounded a lot more like a porn than horror flick  Wonderful night.

Today I had a customer on the phone who lived near Travis AFB.  I said "I used to live near where you are on a little Naval base called Pt Molate" knowing she would have never heard of it.  She said, "I used to be in the Navy and my job was to maintain the oil storage facility at Pt Molate".  We were both stunned.  Not a dozen people alive today were there at that time and here were two of us on the phone together.

Kismet.  Also, I fixed her issue.  So all good.

Comments

[susandennis]

that is so cool! amazing and so cool.

[mrdreamjeans.livejournal.com]

What an absolutely wonderful coincidence!!! Does it still exist today?

[bill-schubert.livejournal.com]

The base has been decommissioned and lots of litigation, apparently, since it was originally native land. Which means, of course, casino. I don't know the current status. It remains as it was in my memory.

[mrdreamjeans.livejournal.com]

It's best then it remains a memory ...

[alefy]

I didn’t think ‘kismet’ is a word used in the English-speaking world!

[mairi-dubh.livejournal.com]

From the Arabic "quisma" for portion or lot, and borrowed into English in the early 1800s from Turkish, according to Google.

It comes and goes rather irregularly in popular usage, but there's even a musical film titled "Kismet."

[alefy]

Interesting. I know the word of course, but I speak Farsi- so that’s expected :D.
As for the musical, I never knew of it.
We learn new things everyday!

[mairi-dubh.livejournal.com]

Please note I don't speak Farsi and did try to cover my bases by indicating "according to Google." I'm allowing the internet doesn't always have its facts right.

But I can state I've heard the word "kismet" since my age was reckoned in single digits or at least no later than barely into double-digits, and I used to encounter it in books---mostly fiction---as well.

The musical production was hugely popular, with a hugely popular musical star (Howard Keel), but of course it's Hollywood and I never count on them for cultural or historical accuracy.

[alefy]

I wasn’t disputing you or Bill. It was just as idle comment to Bill expressing my wonder for coming across a word I had not seen used in English, but only in Farsi. As for the musical- as I said, I learnt a new thing. I do not know much about Hollywood past or present either. Anyway, no dramas, all good.

[mairi-dubh.livejournal.com]

Disputed! Oh, my goodness, no: I didn't think or feel that you were disputing!

Please tell me, though: I understood Farsi to be the Persian language, and distinct from Arabic? Am I mistaken in that?

[alefy]

It is separate to Arabic. But it does have many Arabic loan words.

[mairi-dubh.livejournal.com]

Ah! Thank you.

Different alphabet from Arabic?

[alefy]

Same alphabet, but Farsi has a few extra ones that original Arabic didn't (I think Arabic does not have one equivalent to 'P', and they often replace it with a 'B'... I am not entirely sure though, so can be wrong)

[mairi-dubh.livejournal.com]

I'm taking your word for it.

I know there's a P / F substitution in one of the Middle Eastern languages, perhaps modern Hebrew? Or maybe it is Arabic. I don't recall, and I'm sorry to be so vague, but generally I remember anything I do remember by some cultural association and in this instance it had to do with food or a specific recipe or cooking or the title of a cookery book focused exclusively on one of the more prominent cultures in Jerusalem.

I know: not much help there, am I!

[alefy]

Clarification, my original comment was not a criticism. It was just me expressing my wonder.

[mairi-dubh.livejournal.com]

That "kismet" is known and used?

Have you ever encountered this statement by James D. Nicoll:

“The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and rifle their pockets for new vocabulary.”

I didn't take your comment as a criticism, but I was concerned that I might have given offense if the English connotation of "kismet" isn't spot-on as it is in its native tongue. It happens. ;^)

[alefy]

Believe it or not, I have heard this one! My husband has often used that quote when I am excited by words I know from Farsi but didn’t realise English uses it too!

[mairi-dubh.livejournal.com]

I believe you! *laughs delightedly* I personally love it when a word or phrase or idiom "clicks" for me and its origin and meaning and so forth make sense to me.

You must be multi-lingual, then, yes? Not bi-lingual, but multi-lingual?

[alefy]

I am a multilingual, I guess.

I speak more than two languages, even though I can read and write 2 of them well, and the other one not that well.

[alefy]

To me, kismet means fate. But I like the fluidity of languages, if the word is borrowed and used to mean a slightly different thing- I see no issues with it.

[mairi-dubh.livejournal.com]

*nods*

I want to say there are points, however, where idiosyncratic usage of expressions or words can create difficulties.

The only example which is coming to mind right now is some summit-type meeting between American and British military officials. Several issues were to be discussed.
For one of those, the Americans felt that not enough information was had, that not enough facts were known, and they said they felt it would be best to "table" that one until more was known. In Amer-English, one "tables" or puts away or postpones the conversation or discussion or matter until a later time.
The British kept saying no, they thought it was not a good idea to "table" that particular subject. In Brit-English, "to table" means to bring to the table for discussion or debate.
So actually, everyone was in agreement, but didn't realize that they were, and some of the participants were becoming irritated by what they perceived as the obstinacy of the other side.

I know I've come across examples of borrowed foreign words or phrases causing actual trouble, usually socially, but at the moment I can't recall any of them.

[alefy]

True.

But in a formal setting when we are dealing with people from different places, there is always a need to 'break it down', to take into account the differences in both vocabulary and culture. I just think it's silly not to.

The word 'karma' actually means 'work', derived from Sanskrit. When I am speaking English, I use the word 'karma', but when people from South Asia use it, they say 'karmafal'... (meaning result of the 'work').

[mairi-dubh.livejournal.com]

It seems likely to me that in the case cited above (my comment), a lot was assumed because of what Sir Winston Churchill---at least I think it was he---referred to as "our common foreign language."

I agree: it is just silly not to be aware of the need to "break it down."

Ah. Thank you for this. I was aware that "karma" isn't the same as "kismet" (thinking they are synonyms does seem to be a common misperception among...let me limit this to Amer-English speakers. The most recent explanation of it I'd encountered is that it means "come back," which I can see being related to being the result of the work.
So, in English karma is..."result [of the work or of what is done]?"

[bill-schubert.livejournal.com]

I'm fairly sure I use my own interpretation of the word. In my brain it is kind of a combination of synchronicity and luck and magic. It has some sparkly feeling to it. It is kind of a poetic word which is why it is seldom used or seen.

[maju01.livejournal.com]

I've encountered the word "kismet" in my lifetime of reading, not often but enough to understand it (more or less).

[bill-schubert.livejournal.com]

It is a funny word in that I think everyone has their own interpretation of it. Which is fine with me. Take it the way you want.

[amw.livejournal.com]

This is a fantastic story, thanks. It's wonderful when random stuff like this happens.

[zoefruitcake.livejournal.com]

What are the chances?!